Hessie Phelan Story

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This Event Happened in Bronx, New York
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Radio Free Eireann Interview With Anna Phelan
April 20, 1996

Following is a transcript of an interview aired on Radio Free Eireann with John McDonagh and Anna Phelan, the mother of Hessie Phelan, who came to the U.S. from Ireland in order to highlight her son's case, and attempt to clear up the mystery of his death.

JM: Here's a quick synopsis: Hessie, a good friend of Radio Free Eireann, and originally from Derry, lived up in Bainbridge in the Bronx. He was taken home by an off-duty cop, and it appears something went terribly wrong when he got to the apartment, in the early hours of the morning. The cop is claiming that Hessie committed suicide with his off-duty revolver, and what has now come to the forefront is that there was a witness, who was in the apartment in another room at the time, and statements are coming out to the effect that the cop actually shot Hessie Phelan in the head.

Anna, give us a little background on Hessie. We knew him up in Bainbridge, and he wasn't one to brag much, but we knew he a was a die-hard Irish Republican. What was Hessie's upbringing like?

AP: Hesselin's upbringing was just normal, like any young guy's. I never had any problems with Hesselin, until the Troubles started. Then he got involved, first by throwing stones in William Street, and he was sent away for 3 months. Then out he would come, and then get involved again, in the 4 o'clock riots, as I call them. Then he was away for 9 months. So each time that he would come out he would get more and more involved, with the result that over the years, he would have spent about 10 years in prison.

JM: Right, and he was in during the time of the Hunger Strike. It was reported in some of the papers that his name was on the list to go on hunger strike.

AP: Probably it was, but Hesselin never really talked about his term in prison. Once he came out that was it. He would never let you know his inner thoughts. Even with a few drinks in him he wouldn't talk about what went on behind the wire, as we called it.

JM: And so what happened then when he got out?

AP: When he got out, I came over here on a visit to Connecticut with my sisters and my daughter. In the meantime we were preparing Hesselin to come to America, to get him away from all that, so that he would have a good life, out of the Troubles. With no work in Derry, the young fellows got involved through boredom - this was excitement. So we eventually got Hesselin to Connecticut. And my sisters in Connecticut started giving him jobs, painting and decorating their homes. I went away for a weekend to the Catskills, and when I returned Hesselin says, "Ma, I'm not going home". I said, "Hold off, you're not a wet brigand out here, and you're making you mind up so fast?". But he says,"I'm not going back to Derry", with the result that he didn't come back.

He spent one year in Connecticut, in partnership with a Belfast lad, which fell apart. So Hesselin then went gone missing for 6 weeks, and I was going off my head at this point. So he finally rings me, and I say "Where in the name of god are you?" He says "I'm down in New York". I say "Where?" "The Bronx". I say' "Oh sweetest Mother of God". He says "Ma, it's like everywhere else - there's good places and there's bad places - and I'm in the good part". So from there on Hesselin, to me, had a good life. He was working, well-respected, and he had a right team of friends behind him out here.Very good friends.

JM: Explain what you think happened, and what you have been able to uncover.

AP: Well from what I have been told when I came out here, Maggie McGraw was the manageress in the Oak Bar. And it seems that Hesselin really got drunk. So she did what she does for most of the young lads down there - gets them escorted home, because she doesn't want them mugged or whatever on the streets. But this night it was her boyfriend, a cop named Richard Malloy, who she asked to take Hessie home to her apartment, and let him sleep it off. Now since I arrived in this country I have been told that Hesselin was really drunk. Really drunk. She asked Malloy, "Take Hessie home". And by rumors he was kind of rough with Hesselin, taking him out the door, and Maggie called "Take it easy Richie" (I think that's his name). And they were arguing. So Hesselin it seemed, didn't want to be taken home. This is what I'm reading into it. And they go across the street to Maggie's apartment. Now I have no animosity towards Maggie. Maggie didn't send Hesselin home to his death. But there must be a problem with Maggie for she hasn't even lifted the phone to say "I'm sorry, how are you?" I had met Maggie you know, back home in Ireland, when she came home with Barney Logue's remains, and Hessie said "You have to go and visit my Ma". So Maggie did visit with me. Now I am up against a wall of silence.

JM: But what happened now in the apartment?

AP: Oh, well I wouldn't have a clue.I'd only speculate.

JM: But what eventually happened is Hessie ended up dead and the cop is claiming that Hessie took the gun off the cop and committed suicide.

AP: Now, would you explain this to me? You have a guy commit suicide. Now how does a dead man pick up a gun, put it back in the holster of a cop, wash his hands...

JM: It's now come out that there are no fingerprints on the gun...

AP: Nothing !

JM: Now you met with the Bronx DA. What kind of support are you getting from the police department and from the Bronx DA?

AP: The DA is a very nice man. And he has his job to do. But I feel at this point - what is it, 4 or 5 months down the road ? - that he should know now by this time which way he's going to go. I would like the DA now to phone me some day during the week and tell me: "Mrs. Phelan you can go home for so many months and come back", or, "We're going to go with the case". But he's the man on the job, he knows what he's doing. So I have to sit and wait.

BM: Do you feel that there's any politics involved? This DA in the Bronx is really embattled to say the least. Governor Pataki has removed him from being the prosecutor of a cop-shooting in the Bronx. Do you think politics enters into this?

AP: Well it looks very much like it, but I would know really nothing about that situation.

JM: We had heard rumours that the DA would look very bad going after a cop when he's not going after cop-killers in the Bronx for the death penalty, so he's tending to back off on this case. What you wanted is to go before a grand jury and see if there's going to be an indictment?

AP: Yes.

JM: Normally when things like this happen there is a medical report. Has there been one?

AP: I've got nothing. I've got a death certificate that states "a gunshot wound to the head". That's it. So what I'm left with is a piece of paper that means nothing at this point in time with me. But you know, a dead man can tell tales too. We're not that far behind .. we can exhume the body and do an autopsy. There has to be some way round this.

JM: Michael Daley will be doing a report in the Daily News on this through his investigation with Internal Affairs of the police department, and the Bronx DA, and coming up with his analysis.

AP: I would like to ask for a lot of help in this case. There have to be guys out there that were in that bar that night, and that DA is sitting down there in that office, waiting on guys to come forward. Lord God, I do not want another family to go through what I'm going through. This guy has shot my son dead. And I don't want him to walk away and do it to somebody else.

JM: Right, and you took very great offense to the reports in the paper about it being suicide.

AP: Oh yes, very, because Hesselin was on the phone the Sunday before this happened, where he had sold his car, and he was buying a motorbike, and joining a biking club. Hesselin wasn't depressed. No way. So here you have , I would say, a rogue cop. I've been through 25 years of trouble back home. You know we have an idea what was done. So you have policemen coming on the scene. They must have known in a minute that there was something wrong. And they may be covering up for this guy. So here you will say you have 4 good cops and 1 bad cop. Why cover up for a rogue cop ? My son didn't commit suicide, no way. I know my son. And those cops that were down there, if any of them are married men with kids, they should step forward. It could happen to their kids any day. How would they like that?

JM: Do you know what the status of that police officer is now?

AP: He's off duty, or on modified duty, I believe.

JM: So what would you like to tell to our audience?

AP: I'm really here to say "Suicide - wiped off". Hesselin didn't commit suicide. Heselin was shot, by this cop. And if there's anybody out there, especially the patrons of the Oak Bar, please come forward and help me.

JM: The witness that was in the room - that we read about in the papers - will he be testifying ?

AP: I wouldn't know anything about a third party. I would only be speculating.

BM: Hessie was a friend of Radio Free Eireann. He used to listen to it, and as a matter of fact when we had him up he was fund raising for a friend of his that was killed up in the Bronx, Barney Logue, as you said, from Derry. So that's why we'll be staying on top of this case.

JM: As I said, Hessie lived just up the street from me, I used to bump into him all the time.

AP: Did you think him depressed?

JM: He was always laughing and cracking jokes every time I saw him. I'll just relate one thing. When Derry won the All Ireland, I was bartending at the Phoenix, and he came in very happy to me, then I let him know. I said "Hessie you must be feeling great that a team from the United Kingdom won the Sam Maguire". He almost jumped over the bar to grab me. I said, "Hey... take it easy!" He had bets there. He won a lot of money that day on Derry.

AP: He phoned me back home, cheering for the Sam MagGuire.

JM: We'll go out with a song from a tape smuggled out of Long Kesh, done by the prisoners,titled "Back Home in Derry"

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