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From notes@igc.apc.org Wed Aug 30 18:42:15 1995 Received: from cdp.igc.apc.org (192.82.108.1) by MediaFilter.org with SMTP (MailShare 1.0b10); Wed, 30 Aug 1995 18:42:16 -0500 Received: (from notes) by cdp.igc.apc.org (8.6.12/Revision: 1.204 ) id OAA21538 for "conf-zamir.chat"; Wed, 30 Aug 1995 14:46:20 -0700 Date: 30 Aug 1995 14:43:59 Reply-To: Conference "zamir.chat"From: ian@aimnet.com Subject: Re: http://mediafilter.org/SJ/Pages/Peace to All To: Recipients of zamir-chat-l Message-ID: <1402317645-3141889@mediafilter.org> In-Reply-To: <1405258356-421777@mediafilter.org> X-Gateway: conf2mail@igc.apc.org Errors-To: owner-zamir-chat-l@igc.apc.org Precedence: bulk Lines: 29 I was born in London during WWII and, although I remember little of it, have survived the murderous attempts of others to kill and maim civilians. I still respond to the bravery of the RAF pilots who took off time and time again to risk their lives to save mine. Your endurance has been far greater and I am sorry the powers that be have not acted more promptly. I hope peace is in sight, but excuse me if I permit myself a smile at the surprise and consternation of those unshaven louts who, being used to chosing who to terrify, were suddenly the recipients of terror. No doubt they thought it most unfair! Your's From notes@igc.apc.org Wed Aug 30 19:14:33 1995 Received: from cdp.igc.apc.org (192.82.108.1) by MediaFilter.org with SMTP (MailShare 1.0b10); Wed, 30 Aug 1995 19:14:33 -0500 Received: (from notes) by cdp.igc.apc.org (8.6.12/Revision: 1.204 ) id OAA21549 for "conf-zamir.chat"; Wed, 30 Aug 1995 14:46:23 -0700 Date: 30 Aug 1995 14:44:34 Reply-To: Conference "zamir.chat" From: 100736@MediaFilter.org Subject: Re: http://mediafilter.org/SJ/Pages/Bosnia On-Line net happening in Hels To: Recipients of zamir-chat-l Message-ID: <1402317609-3144078@mediafilter.org> In-Reply-To: <1402450244-368815@mediafilter.org> X-Gateway: conf2mail@igc.apc.org Errors-To: owner-zamir-chat-l@igc.apc.org Precedence: bulk Lines: 31 As an Englishman, I am ashamed that my country has done nothing to allieviate the suffering caused to your country by the terrorists that have torn your country apart. I feel that the military strikes now taking place, whilst justified, are too little too late. This should have been done 2 or even 3 years ago, when perhaps many more lives would have been saved, and many more bodies would have been saved from crippling injuries. I hope that now the NATO alliance will keep up their vigil and will remove any weapons that they find to be a threat to the people of Sarjevo. God Bless you all.. and may peace be with you soon. Love Les An Englishman From notes@igc.apc.org Wed Aug 30 19:17:05 1995 Received: from cdp.igc.apc.org (192.82.108.1) by MediaFilter.org with SMTP (MailShare 1.0b10); Wed, 30 Aug 1995 19:17:05 -0500 Received: (from notes) by cdp.igc.apc.org (8.6.12/Revision: 1.204 ) id OAA21563 for "conf-zamir.chat"; Wed, 30 Aug 1995 14:46:29 -0700 Date: 30 Aug 1995 14:44:05 Reply-To: Conference "zamir.chat" From: doctorc@ix.netcom.com Subject: US Attacks Serbs Lest Onus For Failed Talks Fall on Bosniacs To: Recipients of zamir-chat-l Message-ID: <199508302141.OAA13709@ix3.ix.netcom.com> X-Gateway: conf2mail@igc.apc.org Errors-To: owner-zamir-chat-l@igc.apc.org Precedence: bulk Lines: 152 From: doctorc@ix.netcom.com (. ) Subject: US Attacks Serbs Lest Onus For Failed Talks Fall on Bosniacs US Uses Single Shelling Of Sarajevo Marketplace as Pretext To Launch 'Disproportionate' Attack on Orders of It's Bosniac Allies Who Refuse To Negotiate Hours After Letter From Karadzic To Carter Accepting 'Contact Group' Plan Is Released In anticipation of American aerial bombardment the UN had withdrawn all exposed "Peacekeepers" from the so called "safe areas" [for NATO this means: safe for Bosnian Muslim artillery and war parties to attack from] so the present "unproportional response" to the mysterious single 120 mm artillery shell in a Sarajevo marketplace could proceed. "Unproportional" may be understood if you look at the first reports of the NATO attack: Wednesday, August 30, 1995, at 4:00 am Pacific time. Reuters: SARAJEVO - NATO planes and artillery launched multiple raids on Bosnian Serb targets around Sarajevo and in central, southern and eastern Bosnia, in a heavyweight operation to silence siege guns targeting civilians. August 30, 1995, at 9:00 am Pacific time. Reuters: BRUSSELS - NATO Secretary-General Willy Claes said alliance air action against Bosnian Serbs would go on, possibly for days, until the Serbs stopped disregarding U.N. orders and came to the negotiating table. 'Orders' to come to the negotiating table? Apparently they didn't need 'orders' from the German NATO head to come to the table. They were already there, or would have been had the US and NATO not ignored them in order to gauge the larger powers-- Croatia and Serbia-- response to their long planned massive bombing of Serb positions. Questions as to who had launched the 120 mm shell, a size both Bosniac and Serb malitias use, was put aside and the dispoportianate 'counter'-attack, long planned, was begun, especially to obliterate news of a letter from Serb leader Karadzic to former President Jimmy Carter released hours before the attack: Tue, 29 Aug 95 14:00:19 PDT, WASHINGTON (Reuter): "[US State Dept. spokesperson Nicholas] Burns noted that Carter's assessment of the letter was that Karadzic now accepted the allocation of just 49 per cent of Bosnia to the Serbs -- much less than they hold now -- and 51 per cent to the Muslims and Croats. These are the figures proposed in a new U.S. peace initiative now under way." 'Text of letter from Karadzic to Carter' Tue, 29 Aug 95 13:30:20 PDT: Atlanta (Reuter) - The following is the text of a letter from Bosnian Serb leader Radovan Karadzic to former U.S. President Jimmy Carter and dated August 28. (About 500 words). The letter was released by Carter Tuesday. In order to keep you informed about our position, I wish to convey the following message to you and to ask that you do all you can to use it to promote the earliest possible resumption of peace talks on Bosnia. You should know that the Republika Srpska welcomes the current U.S. peace initiative and reiterates its commitment to a peaceful solution. In the light of this, the Republika Srpska is prepared to negotiate a comprehensive peace agreement which could lead to the formation of a Union constituted by the Republika Srpska and the Federation of Bosnia and Herzegovina. The outstanding territorial issues between the Republika Srpska and the Federation of Bosnia Herzegovina would be settled in the course of the negotiations. To provide an indication of the provisions which we believe should guide the negotiations, I am attaching a statement which sets forth the basis for our willingness to accept the U.S. peace initiative as a welcome effort. The Republika Srpska is prepared to negotiate a comprehensive peace agreement, on the basis of the current U.S. peace initiative, which could lead to the following arrangement: A. A union may be constituted by the Republika Srpska and the Federation of Bosnia and Herzegovina B. There shall be balanced and equal treatment of the Republika Srpska and the Federation of Bosnia and Herzegovina C. Both the Republika Srpska and the Federation of Bosnia and Herzegovina shall have the right to establish parallel special relationships with neighboring countries D. Any future political arrangements brought about by any community within either the Republika Srpska or the Federation of Bosnia and Herzegovina will not change the status of the other side, as described in subparagraphs A, B, and C E. The territorial proposal contained in the U.S. peace initiative will remain the basis for settlement and will be open for adjustment to benefit the interest of both parties F. The full catalogue of human rights and fundamental freedoms as set out in international instruments will be respected, including the right of refugees and displaced persons to be able to return to their homes of origin, which must be an overall process G. As soon as agreement is reached on recommencing peace talks, the Cessation of Hostilities Agreement of 31 December 1994 will be reinstated on a permanent basis. Ends text What had been the Bosniac tone of the 'Contact Group" plan lately? "After meeting Jacques Chirac, the French president, Alija Izetbegovic. . demanded that all Serbian artillery around Sarajevo be destroyed. 'On my return to Sarajevo, I will propose a suspension of peace negotiations', Mr. Izetbegovic said. 'We demand that the Serbian artillery be destroyed. Before that is done, our participation in the peace process has no interest." (1) The Americans quickly obliged their ally, lest this they be seen as the obstacle to talks as time goes by. An analysis on pg 8 cautions "The British fear that too strong a response could cause the war to widen and could make it appear that the United Nations and its peacekeepers have taken sides." Who would be so foolish as to conclude that, as 600 shells land on Serb HQ in Pale, adjacent Sarajevo, and the city, after 22 hours, is still under bombardment? "[Izetbegovic's] comments appeared to echo remarks by Gen. Rasim Delic, the commander of the Bosnian army, who declared on Monday that the new American peace proposal was ``without a head and without a tail'', adding that, ``We have only one direction, and that is to continue fighting.'' Delic, whose offensive earlier this summer, aimed at lifting the Serbian siege of Sarajevo, failed, has been a persistent proponent of a long war aimed at ``liberating'' all Bosnian territory." (2) (1) 'NATO Jets Attack Serbian Positions Around Sarajevo' NY Times Aug 30 95 p1 (2) N.Y. Times News Service By ROGER COHEN as quoted in BOSNEWS Digest 381, August 29, 1995